DR. JOE
We discovered that when we tell the story of our past, it actually reaffirms the emotion that keeps the person stuck there. My job then is to help people to get past that point. When you master your emotions, the body’s no longer enslaved emotionally to the same experience, and that’s when you see these dramatic changes in people’s health and our biology.
If
KELLY
somebody comes to one of your in-person retreats, they can
DR. JOE
walk in sick and leave healthy. I’ve had people on the stage that have healed from really serious health conditions, genetic disorders that medical science didn’t have a solution for. There’s no therapy, there’s no pharmaceutical, there’s no drug that has that kind of efficacy,
KELLY
this concept of abundance. I love the way you handle the subjects. I want to shed light on your perspective.
DR. JOE
We’ve been programmed into abundance being monetary or material or financial. That’s one slice. Of the abundant person’s mindset. Study people that are abundant [00:01:00] and you’ll learn that they failed.
Many times, if I keep thinking differently, if I keep acting differently, if I keep feeling differently, by embodying the qualities of an abundant person, my life should change. And that’s what you prove to yourself when you get that. The side effect of that is the first thing you wanna do is you want to,
KELLY
if you are an overachieving under receiving woman, you may already know that the sleep, energy, weight, skin, hair, and digestive struggles you’re chronically trying to hack are somehow related to the bitterness, overwhelm, resentment, and exhaustion you struggle with in your work mothering and relationship.
I couldn’t be more thrilled to announce that after 15 years in the clinical and digital trenches as a holistic psychiatrist and coach, I have packaged the heroine’s journey home. To ease soft power and the capacity to handle more of the challenges life brings and to hold more of the abundance. It’s called the Relaxed [00:02:00] Woman System, and it includes my history making 44 day nervous system reset.
It’s the only one available with published proof of its efficacy. As well as the path to truly embodying your femininity so that you can experience the specific pleasure of who you are, as well as access to the insider resources for Living the Relaxed Woman lifestyle that I’m known for curating. It’s a six month tailored journey, all for less than $2,000, and it’s designed to be the very last self-improvement program you ever invest in.
Head over to Kelly Brogan md.com/rws. Hi, and welcome back to Reclamation Radio. I am Dr. Kelly Brogan, and today I have Dr. Joe Dispenza back on, and this time we unpack. I give a little soliloquy about my experience at his. Event, I was gifted a ticket and I went, [00:03:00] and boy do I have things to say about it. We also talk about his latest offering after many, many, many requests over the years, which is on the subject of abundance.
We talk about what the personality of scarcity is versus the personality of abundance. What is required to make the shift, what money is, what abundance actually means, and I’m not sure there is a better ambassador for this than the one and only Dr. Joe. So enjoy. Welcome back for our second conversation.
I am so, so excited to chat with you and to specifically unpack. My experience at Marco Island. So welcome back, Joe.
DR. JOE
Thank you, Kelly. I’m happy to be with you.
KELLY
I think I’m the only one who calls you, Joe. I know I’m supposed to call you Dr. Joe, but
DR. JOE
No, no, I, Joe is really, really great. I’ll take that. It
KELLY
stuck.
I just need to treat you like a, like a normal civilian,
DR. JOE
[00:04:00] please.
KELLY
So, so I was in a place when we did our first interview where I had assumed that because I did Kundalini yoga teacher training like a decade ago, and I have a strong meditation practice that I like. I know what you do is important, but like I don’t really need it, right?
So like, it’s like for other people and I was gifted a ticket and I’m not sure I would’ve prioritized going for a whole week leaving my cats and my kids and all the thing, had that not been the case. And then it worked out that my two best girlfriends were completely and enthusiastically onboard. One of my girlfriends, Tara had already.
Ben and is close friends with Gabe, who’s been one of your subjects. And you know, so the web is like very, very strong in our, our shared world. So I thought, okay, this is meant to be, I’m gonna go, I had such an extraordinary experience. I describe myself as a healthy [00:05:00] person who doesn’t have like a specific problem to work on.
Right. And I would describe it as life changing, like what went on in that week. So I want to unpack it before we get into a subject that I know everybody wants to hear about from you. And you know, everybody wants to hear about from you, which is abundance, and I wanna talk about my experience. And you just feel free to jump in.
DR. JOE
Sure, sure. I’d love to hear. Okay,
KELLY
so there are like three tiers that I wanted to share about. One was my personal experience. And another is my experience of you as a creator teacher, you know, founder space holder. And the last is actually of the, your creations, like the business. Because I’m an entrepreneur and I have always like this hat on that experiences the [00:06:00] operational dimensions of a business and the impact and influence of a business and the organizational aspects.
So I wanted to sort of share in those three dimensions, I guess. Okay. So firstly, my direct experience was framed by like a worldview that shifted for me. And this is really, this is probably the first time I’ve tried to articulate it, but my work is, and my journey has. Put at the apex, like at the pinnacle, this concept that the meaning of your struggles, in fact, I’ve like penned a phrase that says, suffering ends where meaning begins.
Okay? The meaning of your struggles is the whole point of your existence, right? And so how do you get at the meaning? Well, you look at the root causes, whether that’s of your physical problems, you know, your biological imbalances, you look at the root causes, psycho spiritually, you look emotionally. [00:07:00] You go back and you dig into the compost heap of your childhood traumas, and you do family constellation work and parts work, and you get more and more clarity about why it is that you’re as fucked up as you are.
And that’s when you integrate and that’s when the shift happens. Okay? So this, this sort of like toil, I don’t know this, this, this. I would say like fetishizing of the work of it was what I brought in terms of my worldview to this and what I experienced. So I’m like a testimonial, absolute junkie. I mean, I, if there’s like a more pleasurable experience in the world than me watching somebody talk about their shift, I’m not sure what it is because anyway, and you deliver.
So the testimonials that were shared, I mean, I was just like weeping in a puddle in my seat just experiencing what people have and, and you obviously on your website have dozens and [00:08:00] dozens and dozens of these, you know, that somebody can enjoy on a Saturday night. The experience of the trajectory of these shifts, however, is very different from the ones that I have observed because.
Sometimes the shift happens in one meditation. Yes. Maybe they’re familiar with your books and you know, your work and they come to the event, or you know, sort of pre, um, you know, loaded. But often the shift just happens and they go from being, let’s say, a sick person. I put that in quotes to an authentic.
Liberated, vital version of themselves. Sometimes in the space of one coherent ceiling or one meditation. Now the meditation may be five and a half hours long, regardless.
DR. JOE
Don’t scare anybody away. I know I wasn’t
KELLY
supposed to say that, right? But, but one meditation, and I didn’t see these people talking about their father wounds and [00:09:00] their childhood sexual abuse and their, you know, um, experiences of neglect and what their fourth grade teacher said to them.
And all of that root cause storying that I think in the rest of the, certainly trauma informed communities who, who endeavor to support people in healing, that’s like a really big part of it, that self-discovery. So that was a major shift for me because, you know, it, it resolved a kind of superiority that I think I’ve developed.
Imagining that if you don’t wanna do the work, then you’re sick and almost. Dare I say like a shot in Freud around that, like, well, look at you. You’re sick. You just get to be sick. ’cause you don’t wanna do, you know, the inner work to understand yourself. And there’s a kind of humility that I experienced just recognizing how if somebody comes to one of your in-person retreats, they can walk in sick and leave healthy.
And why not? Why not make it that [00:10:00] easy? You know?
DR. JOE
Yeah. Well first of all, there’s nothing wrong with that approach. Uh, the seven day event is a really immersive experience. Like you come and you gotta go all in. And the whole reason number one, why we started doing all the scientific research was because we witnessed a real transformation that took place in one week.
And I have to say that for the most part, I was more surprised than anybody when I saw really serious health conditions. Even some of them are genetic conditions that we, we don’t even have solutions for. But from a medical standpoint. Go into complete remission. And when you see that once, okay, that’s an incident.
You see it twice. Okay. It’s a coincidence when it just keeps happening. I think we have over a thousand testimonials now where people have just these dramatic changes. So we, we, we immersed ourselves in discovering is it true that people change at the end of seven days? And the answer for the most part, is absolutely yes.
And it’s not just a small percentage. Our data says [00:11:00] that it’s like 80% of the population, 84% of the population, 90%, 95, a hundred percent depending on what we’re measuring. So the immersive experience really is to reframe your understanding of what change in transformation is and taking people past that point where they normally stop.
’cause that’s, that’s when the brain changes the most. That’s when they change the most. So they have to get past, I can’t, it’s too hard. I’ll never change. It’s my mother’s fault. I have this trauma. I. They gotta get past their blaming and complaining and making excuses and feeling sorry for themselves. And then primarily the emotions, um, that keep them in the past.
Right? So you could only talk around this, right? You, it’s like trying to explain what a mango tastes like. You have to like eat it. So that immersive experience is a lot of content, a lot of information, and the information is to reframe your understanding. And then once you start understanding and start creating a new mind, then the application or the personalization or the demonstration or the initiation of the act to [00:12:00] prove to yourself that it is the truth is where it gets really exciting.
So I give people numerous opportunities to overcome themselves. Numerous opportunities, uh, to connect. And sooner or later they do. And when we study the language of transformation, we have language specialists that have spent an enormous amount of time looking at the language that people use. They’re always, they, for the majority of people, they start off curious.
Right? And then there’s a challenge, which is I think nobody changes unless they’re challenged, right? So I provide a challenge for them to overcome themselves. And some people see it as a challenge. Some people see it, you know, as a struggle, but whatever it is. If they overcome that, then they have this immense connection either to the work, to their, to themselves, to their heart, to the field, whatever it is.
And then the transformation ensues afterwards. And so it is a process and it is a reframing and it’s, it’s really healthy to see that, that the story that we discovered, that when we tell the story of our [00:13:00] past, it actually reaffirms the circuitry and the brain. And it kind of also reaffirms the emotion that keeps the person stuck there.
Right? So, so our, my job then is to help people to get past that point. It’s the emotion I think that matters the most. ’cause the memory without the emotional charge is wisdom. So when you master your emotions, you master your creations. When you break free from that. The body’s no longer enslaved emotionally to the same experience.
And that’s when you see these dramatic changes in people’s health and, and, and, and our biology. You know, our study of that says the brain changes. The heart changes, the face changes, the voice changes, the language changes, the microbiome changes, the blood changes, the genes changes, breast milk changes, tears change, breath changes.
Everything changes when you change.
KELLY
And the conditions that are seemingly required for that change include the framework. So that’s why you deliver so much information scientifically batched information. But it’s [00:14:00] also the dissolution. It’s what I would summarize as a pattern disrupt, right? So it’s the dissolution of the routinized way that we relate to time and space.
So we are. In a ballroom, let’s say for a week. And we’re not given a specific schedule. So, you know, a type A like me doesn’t know exactly what’s happening, when and how long it’s gonna be. And all of that executive functioning is mercifully, you know, put offline. And I will tell you, I, so I was with my two girlfriends, and I’ll tell you that within 24 hours we were hysterically laughing because we had already lost the thread.
I mean, this may not translate, but I’ll tell you a funny story. So I sit down at one point, this was probably the second or third day I sit down and my friend, and it’s tight. I mean, what were there 1500 people there? Okay. Something like that. There’s a lot of folks in that room. [00:15:00] And the seat next to me. Is for my friend, right?
And so I look at her and I say, and I only remember this ’cause we laughed about it for so many times. Afterward I go, you can skee over here because I have plenty of time. What I meant to say obviously was like, I’ll scooch over because there’s plenty of room, right? So like literally my grasp of language started to dissolve and I am talking about spa time instead of space.
There was one point where we were going like food shopping for snacks or whatever, and I go, I said, I said, we have to get snacks for all day. Yesterday, like I would say like this, like the whole week my grass was, was loosening. And it was funny, like there was a kind of effervescent feeling that began to.
Surface. And there was, I mean, I wanna talk more about how you hold space, how I experienced you as myself, a space holder, you know, holding space. [00:16:00] But there was no, never any, the integrity with which this space was held. There was never any manipulation of that. Right. So not even interpersonally, right? So in a lot of these kinds of retreat spaces, there’s, there’s an effort to help people feel their hearts, feel, love, feel connection.
And so there’s a lot of like small group work and sharing and like eye gazing and whatever. There wasn’t any of that that I experienced. Okay. And yet, the love, the kindness, the compassion that started to, and the lightness that started to move through the entire space by, I would say like the second or third day was so natural a phenomenon.
It was so un unforced and un architected that I imagine it had a lot to do with the way that, you know, to very simply. Create the conditions for this, this pattern, disrupt this dissolution of a, a typical relationship to time and space.
DR. JOE
Yeah. And, and yeah. You know, that’s not, that’s very [00:17:00] well, we’re very well described, and my job is to keep people inspired.
Uh, to keep going forward, right? So knowledge is a great way for people to really understand that maybe they’re not perceiving the world the way it really is. So, so you build a model of understanding and once, uh, the important point is as you learn, you gotta share it, right? So we do a lot of, you know, teach back, because if you can’t explain it, it’s not wired in your brain.
And when it comes to the application, you may doubt right, or you’d be uncertain, right? So when you understand what you’re doing and why you’re doing it, the how has meaning, right? And when you assign meaning to the act, the, the frontal lobe switches on, you want a greater outcome. So nobody’s excluded, right?
Everybody is included in that process. Everybody’s overcoming themselves. They’re overcoming their thoughts, you know, they’re overcoming, you know, their emotions, they’re overcoming their habits. And so everybody’s kind of in the crucible. And then there’s a loosening that starts taking place. Usually it’s around the second day.
Sometimes it’s the third day. People [00:18:00] start getting it, they start understanding it and they start getting more conditioned. And there’s literally a deconstruction and reconstruction that goes on right down to the cell. Right down the cell is deconstructing, reconstructing at the same time. That’s what our data shows.
So once you start that reconstruction process, there’s dramatic changes in biology that take place and you do feel L looser and lighter and freer, and we get 1500 or 2000 people doing that. There’s a collective network that all of a sudden starts to emerge. And when people behave the same way, and in fact any organism that behaves the same way, there’s an emergent consciousness that’s take that takes place and it.
Literally reflected in gene expression. You know, that’s what we discovered. Like at the end of seven days, 80% of the people, even though they have their own genotype in genes, make proteins at the end of just seven days. Everybody’s expressing the same genes and making the same proteins. The flock, the herd, the tribe is evolving biologically together.
And we discover that people change people. So [00:19:00] there’s a lot of dynamics that go on at an event. But yeah, there are long days. Uh, there’s a lot of content, there’s a lot of doing, and we gotta, you know, my job is to keep people inspired in the whole process.
KELLY
And this is where I encounter. So I wanna talk a little bit about you put you on the hot seat.
This is where I encountered the paradox of how much this etheric realm, you know, it’s like, it’s like a domain that you’ve created, how much it has to do with you. How much it has nothing to do with you. And I don’t think I’ve ever experienced in all of the spaces I’ve been in teachers, I’ve worked with the paradox at this level.
Right. Because the way that you, I mean, you were on the mic. I don’t wanna scare people away 15 hours a day. A lot. Okay. 17. You personally were on the mic the whole time for every single day. Okay. I don’t [00:20:00] have a lot of experience in the event space. I’ve only held one. I had 10 other women on the stage presenting.
I was sitting down, I was enjoying the experience myself. You could easily, and we were, you were joking about this, you know, press play when a 90 minute meditation was about to start, but it’s your presence and your energy. That makes that 90 minutes feel for many of us, like 10 minutes, seven minutes. I mean, it’s extraordinary how, especially as like a very impatient person, you know, who likes to know the container I’m dealing with, that was extraordinary, and I imagine has to do with the fact that you are commanding the transmission the entire time.
I don’t know that there is anybody who does events, who takes the level of responsibility and custodial the custodial offering, right? Like the, you are saying, I’m, you’re here for an experience. I’m going to make sure that that experience is delivered and I’m gonna do so by, you know. [00:21:00] Actually performing.
I mean, it’s not quite the right word, but that’s, I mean, you’re like a dj. You’re, you know, you’re, you’re teaching and lecturing. You are hilarious. The, the comedy, I swear the comedy that came out of that week, we were rolling in the aisles like, you’re such a funny storyteller and that you do this at this stage, I’m not gonna reveal your, your chronological years at this stage in your life.
The vitality that you obviously have and the energy that, that this practice, this offering gives you. It’s extraordinary to behold. And I, I just don’t know that it’s really matched because most of us who have the opportunity to teach and offer live experiences really kind of show up for the, the VIP spotlight moment, and then we talk back and let somebody else.
Hold the space and I, I just found that extraordinary. So that’s you, and it’s very specifically you. It’s your gifts, your talents, the way that you move your [00:22:00] energy, the way that you have embodied all of this information and wisdom, your belief, your passion. And yet, I would, nobody would ever say, oh, go to Joe Dispenza personally, like, as a PR practitioner, like, go to him.
He’ll heal you. Right? Like, no offense, I don’t think anybody’s gonna say that. That’s not how you are experienced as the source of the healing. You know what I’m saying? So that’s extremely unusual because when there is this larger than life person on stage for whatever it is, 40, 50, 60 hours, I don’t even know the math, usually there would be a guru effect.
Where then you imagine that that person holds, you know, the keys to your healing, but somehow it’s not about you. And that’s also why so many people can translate your work. Um, I mean, I joined, we’ll talk maybe a bit about the coherence feelings. I joined a group and it is about you, but [00:23:00] it’s like, for sure not, you don’t have to be there.
And we’re doing the work and it’s like, about the field, I suppose.
DR. JOE
Sure. And it’s, and I never want it to be about me. I want it to be about you. Like, I want, I wanna, I want it to be about you. And I, I don’t think there’s anybody that’s so special to be excluded. Right. So the stories of transformation that I witnessed, I mean, we had one on the stage, just, I just got back from Orlando a few days ago.
The stories of transformation are, are what inspire me. Like, like it’s, it’s not about me. I mean, these, these people have, they’re my heroes, right? They have. They, they’re on the stage telling their stories of change, and this is a four minute mile, and they’re in, they’re telling the truth, they’re speaking the truth to a group of people, and everybody’s leaning in because they know it’s the truth and they’re, they’re identifying with that person independent of their age, their diet, what they look like, how young they are.
None of that matters, right? So to me, that being a part of change and transformation [00:24:00] and being able to facilitate that, really what inspires me the most is I, I say to the scientists all the time, I, I can’t believe this is the truth. Like, I can’t believe it’s the truth. And number one, and number two, you can’t call it pseudoscience anymore because we’ve proven hundreds and hundreds of times.
There is a connection between the mind and the body. Then, then what about your life? Like if you change, does your life change? And the answer is absolutely. So. So I love having it be about the person I want it. I want, I want to challenge people to be their own heroes, right? I want them to come up against themselves and instead of quitting, breaking through, and there’s an empathy.
I think that that is innate in us when we share another’s transformation. Like when I see somebody change in transform, it’s worth more than all the money in the world. All the gold in the world to me is seeing that change or transformation is why I’m here. Like, how far down the rabbit hole could we go?
Are we programmed into believing that we’re limited and we start seeing people [00:25:00] doing really, really amazing things that would probably scare the audience when it comes to healing, you know, growing tissues and organs back that I would never in my lifetime ever expect. And what does that mean? It means we’re programmed into something else that we’re, that you know that that’s not possible, but, but.
If it is possible, it means that the human body has the innate capacity to regenerate itself at any age given the right information. So for me, I see the science, I see the, I see the um, the stories of transformation. I see the evidence. And then the next question is, if this is true and this is true, can I take a commune of people and see if this is true and can I stretch them to the next experience?
And I haven’t lost faith in human beings as a consequence of it. So the empathy is like pro-social networks switch on. We tend to bond, we tend to move closer together. We’re more appreciative of the moment, more appreciative of each other, and we discover that people change people. [00:26:00] So my job is to get out of the way and keep, uh, keep the person informed and, and keep them inspired.
KELLY
So if you have a parent or an aging loved one who is struggling with balance joint stiffness or simply getting around, you may have wondered what you can possibly do to support them. And I believe that I have found the solution for our parents, if you are in my generation. So Juve micro Impact platform is one of the most effective and science backed ways to improve mobility because it delivers precise, low magnitude vibrations through the soles of the feet that improves circulation and help.
Maintain stability. There’s no sweating, there’s no strain. You literally just stand on it for 10 minutes a day. I speak to the Juvet CEO, rush Simonson in episode one 14, and I learned that his own mother, who is in her nineties, went from bed bound to [00:27:00] fully mobile with this simple daily routine. So if you wanna be sure that somebody that you love stays healthy and independent, go to juve.com/kelly Brogan and use the code Kelly 300 for $300 off at checkout.
You can bring this incredible science-backed tool into their lives, and I think it’s one of the most thoughtful and powerful investments that you can make in their wellbeing. So again, it’s juve.com/kelly Brogan, and the code is Kelly 300. The three dimensional ways that you do that so that this. Passion, which I share, you know, that this passion translates into offerings, into service.
The three dimensional operation that you run, the business that you run. And it’s many are, I had no idea. I mean, you over the course of the week shared, you know, different service [00:28:00] related projects and different, you know what, I guess we would be called like B2B, like, uh, you to trainers, right? So clinicians, practitioners, and then the B2C arm of course, which was me sitting in the seat, what you have going on and your level of chill.
It’s like, how, how do those, I mean, if that is not a testament to the power of this work, I was floored to take in the impact and influence that this work is having just quietly, right? Because of course, I mean everybody, you’re a household name, um, however. The extent to which you have inspired service in those who are touched by this work.
I mean, I, I befriended one of your volunteers, Juliet, and I’m just even learning about her experience as a volunteer, like the dedication, the devotion, the inspiration, the bidirectional, you know, fulfillment that happens was [00:29:00] really amazing. And so I, I’d love to just hear a little bit about how the business, right?
’cause there is a business that you run, and this will be a segue into the topic of, you know, uh, three dimensional wealth and, and it’s sort of five dimensional origins. But how that translated into this like juggernaut of, of service and the coherence groups and healings and the way that so many are, including myself, um, feel lit up about paying it forward.
I mean, that to me is such a testament to. Your humility and your selflessness in this, in this, you know, pedagogical realm and experiential realm and your books and your teachings and your programs, it’s so much bigger. You know, what you have tapped into. And it goes beyond even just the scientific validation of what you’re doing.
Right. So that’s really what I came to appreciate. It’s like, you’re in prisons, you’re in [00:30:00] schools, you know, there are how many coherence groups, I mean, going on every single day offering healings to people in, in need.
DR. JOE
Yeah. Well, first of all, thank you. But I never planned on doing any of this, to be really honest, really honest.
But you know, I, my whole theory in the very beginning when I started this journey was, I’m only gonna go where I’m, I’m invited. If no one invites me, I’m gonna do something else. Right. But there was this constant invitation and my, my desire is always to evolve my experience, right? I just wanna, I wanna get better at understanding things, and I want to get better at doing things right.
So. You know, I think we’ve run 63 week long retreats now. I’ve spent over a year of my life in a ballroom for week long events. And, you know, I, I, I think it’s down to two things. It’s love and logistics. That’s how we run events. That’s just it. I mean, it’s either a love problem or a logistics problem. And I, I am nothing without my team.
Like my team is amazing and, and, uh, yes, they’re very well trained. Uh, and, and they, [00:31:00] and they have to be mission driven. And it’s, it’s, it’s so important to have a vision that’s bigger than us. And if you talk to majority of people that work, for me, their mission is to be a part of change and transformation because witnessing that, uh, is such good news compared to the world that’s, uh, changing in so many ways that there’s good news involved in that.
And it’s kind of the small micro culture of individuals who want the same thing. So we have a strong community and what I’ve learned over the years is community is my greatest value. It’s my greatest asset, right? And I wanna nurture that, right? So. Um, what happens is when people change and they break through the, you know, your heart opens up and then what is the next thing, right?
What is the next thing? How can, how can I make a difference? Or, you know, people manifest health or wealth or relationships or mystical or whatever, and they’re so lit up from their transformation and change that they wanna be part of it, right? So. I run my, I run my, uh, my [00:32:00] companies really simply on three things, right?
Mission is, is just, you know, something that’s ongoing, you know, to transform individuals or have an impact, help people change their lives in some way. And we change enough people, maybe we can make a difference in changing some aspect of the world. So that’s my mission. My team shares the same mission.
It’s a selfless mission. It’s bigger than us, and in some way I feel like we’re doing, uh, our part with that. But what keeps us on that mission, or keeps us on purpose, really, for me, is just two things, and it’s competence, which is, you know, mastering whatever you do, whatever your position is as a player.
Just be really badass. Good at what you do is know that, you know, uh, that you’ve mastered whatever it is so I can count on you, which is the third thing. Accountability. That, and that is like showing up. And if you’re gonna, if you say you’re gonna do something, you do it. If you’re asked to do something, you do it.
You own it, right? And I think when you put those three things together, you have excellence in an individual. But [00:33:00] more importantly, with my team, we have trust, right? Because I would never try to get in anybody’s way that’s running who’s an expert or whatever they’re doing. They know more than me. Uh, but what, what is the safety is that if someone is no longer accountable or they lose, you know, their competence, or they’re no longer good at what they do, or they lose their mission, they’re outstanding.
They stand out right? In the culture because someone has to stop what they’re doing and do their job, right? So there’s this kind of, this autopoiesis that takes place. So I look for people that are very, very, you know. Driven in that way and willing to learn. So we’ve learned a ton of stuff in running events and I always wanna learn from my mistakes.
I wanna learn from how things change. And if you, you can’t learn, you can’t adapt. Right? So, so we’ve, we’ve made great progress with that. And then people who really want a make to make a difference, they’ve created nonprofits. And those nonprofits have nothing to do with me. They just wanna raise money to bring it to [00:34:00] prisons, to bring it to veterans and Navy Seals and Green Berets.
We have 15 Green Berets at our last. Event last week to, um, indigenous tribes. Like this is just their mission, right? It’s their, it’s what they wanna do. And, you know, again, it keeps growing. I, I, I don’t know if I really wanna do that when it’s presented to me like, oh my God, we’re gonna do that. But if it’s truly my mission, then I wanna be able to figure out people who can work with people who actually can lead in that way.
Right. And again, it’s gotta be selfless. It can’t be about them. It’s gotta be about, you know, what, you know, how they contribute. So a lot of things have sprouted. We have physicians now and, and healthcare providers that’s want, want to learn a new language to be able to interact with their patients and their clinics.
And that was another, you know, uh, outgrowth. And then we have, I think 17, uh, coherence Healing groups. I think we heal over 35,000 people a year. Maybe it’s a little more than that now. And yeah, we have, you know, doubleblind. [00:35:00] Placebo studies that show that nine out of 10 people with PTSD that get a remote coherence healing no longer have PTSD.
I mean, I mean it, you know, you, you have to take a moment and wrap your mind around that because there’s no therapy, there’s no pharmaceutical, there’s no drug that has that kind of efficacy. So when you see nine out of 10 people responding and, and they’re laying in their house somewhere in, you know, St.
Paul, Minnesota, and, you know, there’s 70 people spread around the globe. And they just have a picture, right? And in the quantum, everything’s connected. If they could get to that field, could they begin to influence that on that person’s field? And the answer is yes, and they got really good at hitting a target, right?
So, so we’re just, we’re we’re doing, we have, we’re, we’re gonna continue those studies, but I always say to the scientists, what does that mean? What does that mean? If somebody is healed, you know, 2,500 miles away from you, it means that we’re all connected, right? And so, if that’s the truth, then we have to, we [00:36:00] have to, we have to continuously push the envelope to see how well, uh, we are at executing that.
So all these different things came out of what we do. Again, you know, my initial response is like, oh God, I’m doing a lot. I don’t know if I can do anymore. And then, you know, then I’m like. And I’m like, oh God, I, I guess I have to do this, you know? And, and if it, if it helps people and you know, then I’m in.
So, yeah, it takes a lot to do it. You know, I’m, my life is about this work. I mean, surf, the surf is up right now. I mean, there’s so many things happening. I just wanna be a part of it, you know, I want to be a part of it with people and, and I have a very round table style with my, with my team in the way that we interact and in the, in the creative process.
And, you know, I really want people to love their job. That’s my number one thing. I want them to, I want them to love what they do. And, and I’m happy to say that the majority of people really love their job, and that makes me happy, right? Because I want them to do that. And that’s when people will really are the [00:37:00] most productive, or the most innovative, or the most creative, or, you know, the most determined.
So, so yeah, we’ve, we’ve learned a lot over the years and, uh, again, my team is just amazing. They know how to do it.
KELLY
Yeah. I think it’s also, again, because you have a rare. Sort of blend of the accountability. You referenced what I would call like a spine, right? Like a strong masculine dominion over the, the expectations, the execution, the delivery on the promise.
You hold a strong container clearly for your business and its meta organization. And then you also are very easygoing it seems, you know, like you just sort of see what comes and see what come not washes up on the shore. And you also are, you know, the front facing content delivery person. Okay. You’re, you’re also the innovator and researcher.
And then I know that you are bluffed by the people who [00:38:00] are in your space. It’s also rare ’cause it’s very common that somebody’s really good at teaching and. In the, in the performance role. And then they’re, you know, a malignant asshole behind closed doors and or their business is like a dumpster fire, right?
So there’s something that you’ve tapped into, and I think it could be succinctly summarized as abundance in this, and I want to hear your definition of it, but in this general sense of the word, and maybe that’s why so many folks have requested over the years that you address this topic. And I came home from my retreat and you had your, your team had just released this course.
And of course I snapped it up and, you know, digested it over the, the week. It was the perfect experience for me to segue into my back, into my life with, and I want to, I want to shed light [00:39:00] on your perspective around this. It’s such, you know, a new age. Trope farm, this concept of abundance. I mean, it’s like everybody’s got the, the manifestation hack or whatever, and I just love the way you, you handle the, the subject.
So that’s why, literally why I, I’m having you on. However, I wanna start with your hesitation, right? Because, because you didn’t really want, you know, you, you often have this little, like, I don’t know, I’m kind of, you know, we’re already doing a lot of things. Do I need to really talk about that? But there was maybe specific hesitation around this subject.
DR. JOE
Yeah.
KELLY
Right. And what was that?
DR. JOE
Well, look, I mean, there’s a thing that happens with people when you talk about money or abundance, right? It’s like talking about religion or politics. You know, for me, I’ve always just stayed away from it. I just, it’s easier for me to not address it because it, it’s personal, right?
And everybody has their own beliefs, their own stigmas, their own conditioning around what abundance is to them. And, and it’s a lot to [00:40:00] unpack. You know, it’s a lot to deprogram to get a person to really understand it. And, and I wanted to be able to, in some way create some type of model that I could work on two levels.
Because I do a, look, look, I, I live in 3D and I, you know, I do a lot of things and I don’t, I don’t sit on my couch and everything comes to me. That’s an illusion that people really, really fall prey to. You gotta keep one foot in the real world and one foot in the quantum world, and you gotta be able to straddle both.
And you gotta be able to work from both of those levels. And so. My staff was just harassing me for like nine months. Like, you should do an abundance course. You should. And I was like, I don’t wanna do one. I don’t, I don’t wanna do it. You know, I don’t wanna do it. And then, you know, I dunno. We had some meeting and then I just said no.
And then I just went and, um, I don’t know what I was doing, but I I, I was traveling. Oh, I just got on the plane though. I was just thinking, and I thought
KELLY
that’s a good default assumption that you were doing that.
DR. JOE
And I thought, oh God, like, dude, like [00:41:00] your mission is to contribute to people’s lives. Like if people actually get, have more resources or find abundance for themselves and you can touch people in that way, then, then step up and, and do it, you know?
So. So that’s what I thought. I thought, okay, listen, I, I have, you know, made my own journey. I don’t proclaim to be like, you know, Mr. Abundance, but I, I have a lot, I have a lot of resources and I have a lot of freedom. And my definition of abundance when I was younger was like to be able to do whatever I want, whenever I want, right.
And, and as many times as I want. Right. And, and it’s changed for me because now my definition of abundance really is having way more than I need, and I owe so much more than I need that I have no lack. Like I have an abundance of wine. Right. I, I don’t have a problem giving it away because I have tons of it.
Like I so, so, so I think there’s qualities and characteristics of a person who is abundant that I think we have to. Address and to [00:42:00] embody and to learn. And then we have qualities and characteristics that keep us in scarcity or keep us in lack. And those are subconscious programs that have to be brought to light.
We gotta, you know, you gotta bring them up because if your personality creates your personal reality, then, okay, if I’m the personality of lack and I wanna become the personality of abundance, the bottom line is, whether you like it or not, is you’re gonna have to change. You’re gonna have to change, you’re gonna have to change the way you think.
You’re gonna have to, uh, you’re gonna have to really make different choices. You’re gonna have to stop doing certain things, you know, has to stop sitting on the couch or whatever. Stop sabotaging your life. Stop, stop having the same experiences with the same people and feeling the same emotions. There.
There’s this unlearning process that has to happen. And if you can inspire people to relearn, you know, and understand. The neuroscience and biology of change and transformation, then you know, you have to really look at the qualities and characteristics of who you wanna [00:43:00] become. So that’s the, that’s a great way for us to kind of.
Get real, right? You gotta get real and then combine like what the highest form of motivation is with the lowest form of motivation. Get teach people like what their definition of abundance is. Because for me, it’s not just money. Like that’s not it for me. An abundance of time, an abundance of love, an abundance of friendships, an abundance of synchronicities, and abundance of opportunities.
I think really for me, probably my greatest joy is the abundance of opportunities. You don’t need money for opportunities. You can create opportunities, right? And that etheric thing that happens, the synchronicities, the opportunities, is a consequence of who you are, right? And then there’s abundance of virtue, right?
And then you can have abundance of material things, but there’s several ways for us to experience abundance. And for me, it’s all those things. So I wanted to broaden people’s understandings of what abundance could be for them. Okay, so you’re gonna have to change. That’s the first thing. And then the, the next thing is, [00:44:00] okay, if I’m stepping towards.
My abundance and I have my goals and I have my mission, I have my own definition of abundance. Okay? Now I’m, I’m equipped, right? And so I gotta get in the plane of demonstration. This is 3D. Reality is you gotta do things to create an experience. You gotta, you gotta, you gotta get, hold yourself accountable and you gotta make different choices and do certain things.
And then let’s talk about creating from the field instead of from creating matter to matter. If I can teach people how to do this, to create from the field and, and start changing information in the field, can I begin to, by definition, start having experiences come to me instead of me having to go and do them?
And those are the, that’s the flow when you’re, when, when things are working for you, Ian. I wanna provide two ways for people to get there, right? To be able to fundamentally do it in the, in the process of change. Because there’s a lot of defaults that can happen where a person all of a sudden gives up on themselves or something goes wrong and [00:45:00] then they’re like, I failed.
No, no, no, no. Study people that are abundant and you’ll learn that they failed many times. It’s just they were persistent. They were determined, they were unwavering. They learned from their mistakes. They got clear again, they adapted and they went forward. Right? And, and that’s real. Like that is a real thing.
They just didn’t run into their abundance. There was a, a process of change and challenge. And, and then in the, in that kind of five d realm of creating from the field, if we do it enough times over and over again, we change our energy. Then the experiment is, okay, if I’m stepping towards my abundance, then the opportunities are gonna come in a way that I least expect, not, not the things that I think should happen.
All of a sudden like, oh, I met this thing, or I got this thing, or that happened, or this came to me and, and then all of a sudden it opens a door for a person. And why is that important? Because that inspires them to wanna keep doing it. Like, oh my God, if I’m investing in myself in this [00:46:00] way, and as I’m investing in myself.
I’m seeing these outcomes take place in my life. That’s the feedback. Like, why would I stop doing it? It’s not like, oh, I have to go create my abundance today. And it’s not like that. It’s like, oh my God, I don’t want the magic to end. I want to keep going. Like, this is exciting. And, um, God, you know, and then putting it all together, being able to do both, you know, the 3D and the five D, and get really real with people and, and help them understand it.
So we’ve gotten great stories already of people that have created abundance and they just stayed with it. Right? And, and, and there’s so many ways to do it. And I want people to be empowered by that process because all the people that we’ve, we’ve studied really in our community that, by the way, they were, some of them were in jail.
I mean, I’m just being honest. Some of ’em didn’t have $2 to rub together. They told me they were bankrupt. You know, they were running from, you know, the IRS, whatever. They had a lot of things going on and, um. Yeah. Now they’re, you know, now [00:47:00] they’re, uh, they, they’re in a whole different place. You know, when you get that, the, the side effect of that is the first thing you wanna do is you want to give, like an abundant person naturally gives, right?
They say, why would I hold onto something if I know how to create it? Right? So there’s this kind of release that takes place ’cause they know that they know. And I don’t think there’s an end to it, but I think there’s a lot of detours that people could make, uh, when they reach a certain level of affluence where they have to keep their ego in check.
And, and I, I do think that people who really, really wanna study it and, and go the full distance, I think the wealth is just one small part of something away bigger. And for me, it’s an abundance of life. I mean, an abundance of life, an abundance of energy, an abundance of life, an abundance of, you know, opportunities.
Those are the things to me that bring, I think, bring people the greatest joy. So we’ve been programmed into like abundance being monetary or material or financial. That’s one slice of the abundant person’s mindset.
KELLY
You [00:48:00] might have a sense that supporting your energetic and subtle body is important, but how exactly does one do that?
Like short of scheduling regular sessions with an energy healer, how do you do that? Most of the time I find. That when we take supplements, it’s from the energy of fixing ourselves. And honestly, it’s really no different than taking a medication at that point. That’s why I love flower remedies, and specifically my girl Katie, has his elixirs from Lotus Way.
The formulations that she creates are so nuanced that sometimes it feels like I wrote the descriptions myself. The last one I took was designed to dissolve. Go, go, go mentality as well as fatigue, weakness, apathy, and resistance to self-care. Relatable. Okay. I have a monthly membership called Flower Revolution where I get a new and super powerful on point Remedy sent to me every month, and it blows my mind how resonant each one is with exactly where I am in my process.
I think of this as a truly [00:49:00] feminine investment that harmonizes my process and allows me to walk, talk, and interact with grace. You can try it for months or six at the link below, and if you just wanna dip a toe into learn more about how flowers heal, you can take their quiz and experience, right, because my sense.
In your definition of which I share of abundance is that it’s a shift into a reality that is fundamentally generous, right? That this reality offers you opportunities and gifts and support. And there’s a sense, you know, some people would call this God, there’s a sense that you are accompanied by a benevolent energy always at all times, right?
So that has all sorts of ramifications for your nervous system and your endocrine system, and then your behavior, right? If you, if you believe that you are sort of like swimming in this realm that spontaneously offers to you everything that you need [00:50:00] and more, because I do think that that overflowing is, is a signature.
Aspect of, of what we’re describing then your behavior certainly changes. So I wonder if in the patterns of personality traits, let’s say, that you have observed are most associated with scarcity. If people are having financial, specifically financial struggles versus romantic struggles as they identify everybody’s got like a hotspot, right?
Versus health. Like, do you think that there’s the personality? ’cause I would say yes. Um, there’s a personality of somebody who identifies as sick. There’s a personality as somebody who identifies as unlovable or alone. There’s a personality of somebody who identifies as broke, you know, and, and constantly struggling with money.
But then if I really get down to the descriptors, I’m like. They’re kind of all the same.
DR. JOE
Yeah, that’s exactly the truth. So, so I think that when the [00:51:00] pain var discomfort outweighs our fear of the unknown, I think is when people really just go, I gotta, I gotta change, right? So what is the catalyst? You know, if you look at, if we back up really back up and get really big, it’s the soul, right?
The soul’s, soul’s on a journey, right? And what is the catalyst? Because we, when we study people that have healed from their health conditions, um, they’re not victimized by it. I mean, I’m, I’m moved by it because they say, no, you know what, I would’ve never. Changed. I would’ve never, ever changed unless I had that health condition.
I would’ve never made the effort and, and that that was the irritation that drove me. So if you can see that well, yeah. There are certain things about, say, comparing a person in lack and a person who’s sick. There may be some variations, but, but what is consistent? Is the things that people limit themselves with when it comes to making change, right?
Because the person who’s sick, I mean, you know [00:52:00] this, a chronic health condition requires a lifestyle change. That’s 95 plus percentage of population. That’s, that means, you know, that’s choices and behaviors, but nobody’s talking about change, right? So, but the person who’s a single mother with three kids who’s living in stress and living in survival and doing their best, that’s a different conversation, right?
That person has to understand what stress and survival is doing to them. And their first hurdle is to move out of stress and move out of survival. And that’s not an easy thing when you’re, when you’re working to, to make ends meet. But by the same means, if you give them a formula to help them from a different dimension, to be able to start seeing if they can produce outcomes in their life.
It all of a sudden it kind of unifies. So the person who’s facing a health condition and a person who’s facing a lack of abundance, there are, there are personality traits that, but we still have to overcome. You can’t use feelings, uh, as a barometer for change. You always talk yourself how to do it. You can’t say, I don’t [00:53:00] feel like it, you can’t make excuses.
You can’t say I’ll start tomorrow. You know, you can’t say, you can’t be envy and jealous of envious and jealous of other people. Um, you can’t focus on worst case scenarios. You know, these are things that we all do when we’re, when we’re out of balance, and. Complaining. You know, all of those things have no vision.
Make no time for yourself. Never invest in yourself. And I always say to people like, really study abundant people. You’ll see that they were, they just had this vision. They were uncompromising to the vision. They made time for themselves. They learned from their mistakes. They adapted. Um, they got discouraged, they got ripped off, they got stolen from, they got back up, they cleaned themselves off and they just kept going.
And it’s the lessons that we learned along the way. I think what stops us. For making those same, you know, choices again in our lives. So there is a, i I, you’re absolutely correct. I think there is a, uh, a unique quality of each one, but there’s a lot of things about the human condition that is similar when it comes time to the [00:54:00] act of changing.
Because people who heal in this work, they’re not doing their meditations to heal, they’re doing their meditations to change, right? And they understand that when they change, they heal. Here, here’s the, here’s the vision of the person, their abundant life. And here’s where they at, where they’re at as a personality.
Or it doesn’t matter if it’s abundance or just getting in shape. If you’re gonna get in shape, you gotta, you can’t be this person any longer. What does that mean? You gotta think differently. You gotta make a lot of different choices. You gotta do a lot of different things. You gotta keep showing up, you gotta be consistent.
Keep recreating the experience, keep feeling the emotion, and all of a sudden you become this person. But the process of change is still the same. And it’s just that it’s just so much easier to forget our vision than to remember it. Right. So there’s gotta be some type of employment for the person to continuously, you know, invest their attention and energy and continue the process, but it’s the same.
Absolutely.
KELLY
Yeah. And I would describe this sort of the collective field of stuckness as victim [00:55:00] consciousness. Like that’s the language I would use. And I also have come to appreciate that there’s secondary gain, right? Like there are things that people get out of their struggles that are often subconscious and very difficult to acknowledge.
Certainly difficult to point out because then you get accused of victim shaming and Right. And blaming the people who are in their struggles for being responsible for their struggles. But it doesn’t seem, again, in, in your work, it doesn’t seem like it’s super necessary to address what you might be getting out of.
Like, if I am chronically ill, I might get boundaries, right? Because I don’t, I don’t have to explain this to you obviously, but I don’t have to say no, I don’t have to learn how to say no simply because I don’t want to, I can say I have a migraine. Um, I also don’t have to ask for attention caretaking leadership guidance because it just comes with being a patient, particularly in the allopathic system, right?
So my needs are [00:56:00] met. The secondary gain is, is quite real in the patient archetype. And the same is true for financial struggles, right? But again, in your work, it doesn’t seem super important to really dive into all that because you can just. When again, like you said, the pain of your reality outweighs the promise of the unknown.
You just can decide, choose to take these steps that you outline to begin to shift your. Reality again, from the, you would call it like the five D, right? And it may, it doesn’t matter to do all the psychoanalysis,
DR. JOE
we’re only looking back to the past and making, telling the story of it. When we feel the emotions of it.
It’s really hard to look at the past when you’re feeling the emotions of your future. Right? And you, we tend to believe in our future more. When we feel the emotions associated with it. So then what does the person stop? Right? They stop [00:57:00] when they try it for two or three days and they, they look around and they say, what, what didn’t work?
Well, you’re not that good. Like you didn’t put your time in. Like you didn’t, you really, it’s not realistic. It’s not. That’s not how it works. Your belief in yourself must be earned. And it’s an initiation, right? It’s an initiation process because the person who ultimately becomes abundant was never about their abundance.
It was who they became. That’s what they learned. Like, oh my God, I was just, I was a miserable person. Now I’m a happy person. And of course, this is what I’m, this is what I deserve. So then you default immediately with an emotional reaction. You can’t see that future any longer. You only can tell the story of your past and 50% of it isn’t even the truth.
We, we make it up because we excuse ourselves from changing. So people are reliving a miserable life. They never even had just to excuse themselves from changing. I think that serious part about that is that they find people in their life that do the same and they use each other to reaffirm their [00:58:00] addiction to victimization.
And you can, you can get a lot of agreement there, right? The person who says enough, like, I want to tell the story of my future instead of my past. I wanna believe in my future more than I believe in my past. Well, the intention to have that future has no fuel. Unless they bring the insight, excitement, the energy, the motivation, the inspiration, the optimism, nobody’s gonna do that for us.
Like that’s something that we have to bring up on our own. So that is the fuel. It gets people to continuously show up and continuously do. And just like learning anything, whether you’re learning how to salsa or snowboard or hit a tennis ball, doesn’t matter in the beginning. It takes a lot of conscious effort.
And if you stick with it, things start to fall into the fold and. It’s easier. And, and that’s, that, that’s when people start stepping out of their past, right? And so we’ve all, we know how to do this. We’ve all done something really [00:59:00] amazing in our life at least once. And what did we do? We just got really clear.
Like, and, and you saw it so clearly that you started to feel the emotion associated with it. And that thought and that feeling, that image and that emotion con constantly doing it, that stimulus and response will condition the body emotionally to be connected to that future. And it’s really a paradox because when you’re feeling the emotions of your future before it happens, you’re no longer looking for it.
Why would you look for it if you feel like it’s already happened? We only look for it when we’re in that mentality of lack or scarcity. When we’re, we’re, we’re in lack. We’re looking like we’re waiting for something out there to change in our life, to take away this feeling of lack. That’s, that’s kind of the old model of reality, of cause and effect.
Some people spend their whole life living in lack. But if you can teach your body emotionally what the future feels like before it happens, and you keep doing that, you’ll consistently believe in that future. And when you do, you’ll behave accordingly. And if you keep [01:00:00] behaving accordingly, you’ll ultimately become it.
And that’s the model, believe, behave, and become. And so what I’m proud of in our community. It is just not philosophical. It’s not theoretical, it’s just, it’s not just, you know, analytical. There is a very practical component to it. And, and I’m, I’m proud of our community because people do the work in the community because when they invest in themselves, they invest in their future and they show up because they don’t want the magic to end.
Once you start hitting a fold, when it starts flowing for you, it’s not like I, I have to, it’s like I, I, I want, I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna stop, like whatever’s working, it’s all coming to me and I, I, I don’t know what, how it’s happening, but I don’t care. I don’t want to jinx it. I don want to keep doing this and, and I think that’s really valuable for a person because they’re no longer telling that story any longer.
This, it’s incidental and you get to tell the story of your past when you overcome it. Right. And I’ve had people on the stage that have healed from. Really serious health conditions. Some of them, uh, [01:01:00] genetic disorders that we didn’t know medical science didn’t have a solution for. And I asked them like, you want to, you wanna tell a story of your healing?
And some of them, you know, a year later say, I don’t even remember that story. Like, like, yeah. So what? I’m not, yeah, they were abused and they had all this stuff and violent, you know, parent. And they’re just like, I’m good. Like, I don’t want to tell that story. And, and that’s the same thing that I, when it, when it, when it comes to like forgiving our past, it’s like when you’re feeling the feelings of your future, you’re good.
Like you’re good. Like everybody’s good. Like you’re not, you’re not obsessing, you’re not in the way, you know, you, you’re, you’re good. And so we, so many people think that. You have to wait for the experience to happen to produce the emotion from the experience, to take away the lack. Sure. That’s three-dimensional reality.
But when you’re creating from field, then you have to feel the emotion before the experience. And that emotion is the energy that literally starts conforming reality. It’s the fuel that begins to change it. So yeah, it’s a practice. It’s a practice. But the [01:02:00] fun part is when the, when it starts to happen, who gets to be the beneficiary of a beneficiary of you do, right?
We do. And then what, what, what, how does that lead? It leads to changes in our relationships with everybody. And then you’re more giving, and we’ve all done this. We’ve all said, I have this vision. And you wrote down the things that you, you needed the, you know, choices you were gonna make and the things you were gonna do.
And your goals. And your experiences. And you got worked up and you felt the emotions. And then you said something really brilliant like. I’m gonna write down the thoughts that are gonna stop me from my future. I can, it’s too hard. It’s this person’s fault. Get really clear because when those thoughts come up, they can’t slip by your awareness unchecked by you.
What choices do I have to stop making? That’s the hardest part about change. Stop making the same choice as you did the day before. You’re gonna be uncomfortable. Okay, I’m gonna be uncomfortable. I know that I gotta stop these habits. I can’t complain. I can’t blame, I can’t make excuses. This is now. Now you’re out of the bleachers and you’re on the playing field because that’s to know thyself, right?
And when you’re in the jar, you can’t read the label. So you gotta get outside the jar, right? And so you [01:03:00] gotta constantly observe the self. Let me remind myself what emotions I’m not gonna feel. What experiences I want to stay away from with certain people at certain times. That is the, that is the breaking the habit of the old self.
But at the same time, if I could become so conscious of my unconscious self that I won’t go unconscious and default. That’s a victory right now. Now, now I’m overcoming my past self. And then. Could I be create a future self? Right? So then how do I wanna think? What do I wanna believe? I believe it’s just a thought.
You keep thinking over and over again. Lemme just keep remembering to think this way. If you keep remembering to think this way, nerve cells that fire together, wire together. You start. Creating a new voice in your head. How, how will I behave differently? Let me close my eyes and rehearse how I’m gonna be in this circumstance.
Lemme review it. And what emotions could I feel if I keep thinking differently, if I keep acting differently, if I keep feeling differently, I embodying the qualities and characteristics of an abundant person, my life should change. And I’m gonna see if that’s the truth. And, and that’s what you [01:04:00] prove to yourself.
And as I said, your belief in yourself has to be earned. No one’s gonna do that for you. No one’s gonna come for you. The person who does it every day, all of a sudden they reach this point where they, they feel worthy. Like they feel really worthy. I’ve put my time in, I’ve made great strides. I’m happy with myself.
And that’s when it all starts to change. That’s, that’s the moment we look for.
KELLY
There’s so much of this wisdom. In that program, of course, however you wanna refer to it, and also the exact meditations and experiences that you anchor yourself into to begin to practice this. Because you know I have a similar, I appreciate you’re like this gentle drill sergeant, right?
Like I appreciate that because I come at change in identity shifts with a similar energy that there’s a kind of accountability, like a go big or go home commitment that you make that anchors. All of the mysterious that’d be phenomenon of, of what is going to emerge. Amazing. Okay. [01:05:00] I have one last question, which is, I just want, we could do a weekend workup workshop on this, but I wonder, I wonder like, how do you think about the nature of money?
Like, everybody’s got their spiritual definition of like what money actually is, but how do you think of the nature of money? Because if people are interested in expanding their definition of abundance, and obviously that includes finances and fiat currency and assets and, and all of these kind of secular definitions, I just wonder how you think about it.
Like when you, when you look at money moving around between folks and transacting, like do you just see energy? Do you see it as a permission slip to be alive? Like do you see it as. Uh, you know, I’m sure this is not the case, but like a feminine thing, a masculine thing? Like how do you conceptualize?
DR. JOE
Yeah, I, I, I think for me, I look at it two ways.
First is just my relationship. I have a relation, I have a relationship with money, like, so I, I know people that have really a really poor relationship with money and, and it’s just no [01:06:00] different than any relationship you have with anybody else. So, and practical, if I have more than I need, I know that if I give.
In that way. And I have a good relationship with money and I’m accountable and I do all the things that I’m supposed to do. I, I, I’ll always have it right. And I, and I, for me, someone was asking me this, one of my staff was asking me, I never in my life really had a thought about money. Like if there’s enough or there isn’t enough.
I just knew that I was gonna be okay. And that, for me, that was important. Now, do I think money is the totality of the way human beings should be living? No, I don’t think so at all. I think it’s a limited way to exchange something based on value. Right? So I’ve paid for things that really were probably way overpriced at times, but I didn’t care because to me, I, I, I was happy with it.
And other times, by principle, I wouldn’t do it. Like just because of a principle like. You know, a principle, I, I wouldn’t do that because I’m principal, but for [01:07:00] me, when it comes to like, you know, portfolios and investing and all that stuff, it just has to make sense to me. And, and I love having experts around me that, that help me with that.
Once I learn and I understand, yeah, that I’m willing to do what I always do in, in, in my life, and that is create or, uh, stretch myself or take a little bit bigger of a risk or chance to see what it, what it produces. So, yeah, for me, money is flow, right? And I, I just think it’s a limited way that we ascribe to real abundance and wealth, because I, I know people.
In my life that are really, really masterful at life and they’re happy with what they have. It’s not the race to see how many millions of dollars they could, they could have. But the fact that, you know, that you can create it to me is where I, I ultimately like to lead our community. Again, I think there’s something transcendent of money that has to do with creating like, I mean, creating opportunities or creating abundance.
Really has [01:08:00] nothing to do with money, it just has to do with your understanding of how to create. So, um, I, I think there’s, I think there’s a, a limited way that we exchange things based on value, but it works. But I, I, I’m practical and I’m, I’m organized and I’m clear and, um, I do like, I do like to, I do like to use it, I do like to play with it.
I do like to, you know, try things out with it.
KELLY
Well, I hope that you continue to move beyond your initial resistance when you are asked to speak on a topic. Because, because we all wanna know your take on so many applications of these concepts and worldview. Related principles and, and also just recontextualize the same teaching.
’cause that’s essentially, you know, what you do on all these topics. It’s, it’s the same fundamental teachings. It’s just, um, the application is tailored to the biases that I think we come with around [01:09:00] like, well, what’s actually wrong if I’m struggling with money? What’s actually wrong if I’m sick? What’s actually wrong if I am alone?
And the reconnection to our creative power, I think is, it’s such a beautiful summary of, of what you offer. And I am so deeply, deeply grateful that you are out there doing this. I mean, like literally every two weeks of your life. Do not understand how you have, I truly, I, I don’t know that anybody does unless they can like see you do it and just witness the phenomenon that you’re doing this.
And you said on stage that you have no plans to close up shop anytime soon. So I’m also very grateful.
DR. JOE
No, I, I can, I mean, like right now, first of all, it’s really difficult for me to stop doing live events because I think there’s something that really powerful that happens. Transcendent of just looking at someone on a, you know, on a screen, two dimensionally.
There’s some multi-dimensional thing that happens when you get people [01:10:00] together. So I always want to do the in-person events because there is that emergent consciousness, uh, that continuously takes place. But by the same means, you know, when we take over a hotel for eight days or 10 days or whatever, uh, we have to book those like years in advance.
So I can tell you that I’m booked for the next four or five years here, and I’ll be doing this, uh, at least till then. Yeah,
KELLY
I mean, this is what I mean too. I mean, it’s like the way that you run your business. I mean, you, you, you’re an extraordinary teacher on the subject of abundance from the very little slice we’re talking about when it comes to entrepreneurship and what it takes to translate a thought to a thing, you know, to, to create from the very, very secular realm of things all the way to the metaphysical.
And I’m just very, very deeply grateful. It. So fun to reconnect to you and I’m sure I’ll be tapping you to come back on in the future.
DR. JOE
Sure, sure. And thank you for all that you do. I’m so happy you came and I, I love what your message is and all the people you’re [01:11:00] helping. I really appreciate it.
