Hi, and welcome back to Reclamation Radio. I’m Dr. Kelly Brogan, and one of the things that I love about my containers is that the women I attract always have audacious questions to ask me. So it’s my intention for the musings that I share on these topics to grow the permission field of what’s possible, and also to offer relatable reframes that can jailbreak you from your victim stories.
So you might notice. That I’m a bit more familiar and free when I’m answering these questions in our private spaces. So take a listen and enjoy. And today’s audacious ask is, how do I understand if I’m self abandoning or if I’m letting others live their lives? How do you walk the line between self abandonment and acceptance of reality?
I’ve observed that, you know, women are kind of meeting this from at least two different. Ends of the polarity, right? Where either you’re somebody who has [00:01:00] not spoken up enough, right where you’ve been in your avoidant tendencies, in your self repression, in your withdrawal, in your invisibility, most of your life, or you’re somebody.
More like me, who has been, you know, seeking safety through speaking up constantly, right? Like needing, it’s the anxious attachment. It’s like needing to always, um, make sure that I put my 2 cents in, always make sure that I am saying my part and whatever. So the easiest way, I think to clarify the first early steps of like self reclamation and.
You know, um, self attunement in this way is to remember that when the motivation is giving to get right, if what you’re doing is a strategy to get something [00:02:00] else that you’re not directly asking for, right? Even if that strategy is shutting up, you’re in the the codependent terrain. Right. So I went, actually, uh, I might have mentioned this to you ladies.
I went to, um, my first like Al-Anon, uh, group, like recently, and I’ve been to many AA meetings growing up with my dad, but I’d never been to an Al-Anon meeting. And, you know, here I am, you know, thinking I, you know, have had such unique experiences and so deeply invested in like the. You know, particular nature of my heroine’s journey and all this stuff, and I’m sitting, yeah.
I was in New York and I’m sitting at this table with all these other people and we are all literally dealing with the same exact thing. And if you’ve been to Al-Anon, uh, you already know what I’m about to say, which is imagining that we know better how somebody else should be doing something. Okay. That is the, [00:03:00] the poison of.
The codependent structure of defense is imagining that it is your job to organize somebody else’s experience so that your world can feel safe, so that your world can make sense. So if you are speaking up from that place, right, from that intention to say, the way I like to phrase it is I’ll get you to see, right?
So. On my side, it’s, I’ll get you to see. So whenever I am in that mode of, I’ll get you to see, even if it’s speaking up for myself or defending myself or making sure that I, you know, um, give my voice space in the room. If the intention is, I’ll get you to see why my perspective makes sense. That is, in my opinion and the opinion of others in this field, um, that is self abandonment, right?
Because you’re running an old strategy [00:04:00] of giving to get right, and it’s not really giving. You’re helping somebody else, let’s say in, in the case of, you know, classic relationship, uh, struggles. You might be thinking you’re helping somebody else, or you’re supporting them, or you’re just, you know, like, no, you don’t wanna get that vaccine.
Here’s why. Right? I’m just, I’m gonna get you to see, you know, why that’s not best for you, right? When you’re in the, I’m gonna get you to see arm of things. You’re not in touch with what it is that you’re wanting to take ’cause you’re too busy in that penetrative controlling energy. Okay? So probably if you were in touch with what you wanted to take in that moment, you would speak the way.
That little inner child part in that exercise spoke right? You might say, I want to feel your love. I want to feel your attention on me. And odds are, as an adult, you’re [00:05:00] most situations, it’s like not gonna make any sense for you to express something like that. Like, you can express that to your boss or like to, you know, to the grocery store attendant or whatever.
So when you actually get in touch with what it is that your little part is asking for, you get to see like, oh, this is not, actually, I’m not gonna actually say that because that doesn’t make sense, right? Like, to my adult eyes. Okay. So the other side of the spectrum, which is the, the, the quiet avoidant folks.
Because my best friend, uh, Tara and I like really explore this. ’cause we have, we’re we’re different in this way, right? So, so she said to me recently, Kelly, she’s like, for me it’s not, I’ll get you to see. It’s just see me, right. Just see me, see me, see me, see me. So you may not be, you may not relate to like needing to convince somebody of your perspective and defend yourself, right?
And all of that get you to see self abandonment. When you are defending yourself, you are self abandoning, [00:06:00] period, period. I don’t think there’s nuance to this. I don’t think there’s an exception to that, especially if somebody has not asked for your perspective on what’s happened. Okay? Because otherwise.
You’re just letting somebody have their damn perspective about what the hell is going on in reality, and you are remaining with yourself. You’re not taking the bait of imagining that you can secure approval, connection, safety in the world by being right about how wrong you are by getting them to see your perspective.
So anytime you need to explain yourself. Now, if somebody says, Hey, what happened here? You know, tell me more. That’s not what I’m talking about. I’m talking about somebody says, here’s what I think. Here’s how I’m living my life. And you unsolicited go in and you’re gonna defend your version of reality.
You’re gonna explain your version of reality. You’re gonna get somebody to see self abandonment, okay? Because you’re not in touch with what you really, that little child part wants. Okay. [00:07:00] On the other side of the like, you know, see me, see me, see me. Spectrum is a suite of strategies, right, that I think of in the like immature, feminine side of things that are meant to just put eyes on you.
But anytime it requires strategies to get attention, you’re not in touch. Same as the other side, you’re not in touch with. The fact that you actually want that, right? Because you’re, you’re performing, right, and you’re curating this behavior just to feel the attention on you, and it’s disconnected from any meaningful, you know, expression that you would otherwise make, right?
So again, if you could get in touch with like the actual desire. So let’s say for example, like I am speaking up in a class just because I wanna feel included and just ’cause I wanna feel I have something important to say and just because I wanna feel seen if I were [00:08:00] instead to be like, Hey, I really love talking to all you guys and gals, and can you all just look at me for a minute and then tell me you really like me?
Like, like if I were to actually express that, probably I wouldn’t raise my hand, for example. Right? So anytime we’re in these strategies around how we can get someone to see or be seen, right? So the penetrative or the receptive, um, arm of things, um, we are out of touch with the deeper longing. So the summary of like.
What is, what is staying with yourself look like? It’s to be in touch with what is behind a habitual response. Right? So like what is underneath the habitual response? For me, the habitual response is proving my point. Okay. So what is beneath of that is when we share a reality, I’ll feel safer. I can get you to share my reality, right?[00:09:00]
That is en measurement trauma, right? Like that comes from an old, old strategy That’s not necessary now. ’cause I can just walk the world letting everybody be themselves and just not take the bait. Like I can, I can play that part of the, the unbothered adult, right? Who’s just like, okay. Yeah. And focus on creating.
Focus on what I want and only interact around what it is that I want. Right? So like, let’s say I get a really inflammatory email from somebody that I want to like sign papers, right? So let’s say I’m in like some sort of, uh, conflict with somebody and I really need them to sign, but let’s, let’s say divorce papers or something.
I really need them to. To sign the papers. They might send me an email that’s like, you know, character assassinating and you did this, and you did that. I’m like, I didn’t fucking do that. What are you talking about? And it’s so tempting to wanna be like, no, no, no. Here’s what happened. Right? Because so many of us have experienced being gaslit.
So many of us have experienced, you know, somebody imposing their [00:10:00] reality that just doesn’t jive with ours. On us. It’s very tempting to go in and defend and fix their perspective of reality. But what is it that I really want? I want them to sign the papers, and of course, what is it that I want through that, you know, you can keep going.
What do I get when that happens? What do I get when that happens? If I want them to sign the papers, I’m only going to focus on that. I’m not gonna take the bait of reorganizing them and fixing them. I’m literally not going to engage that, and I’m just gonna say, you know, I need you to send the papers by Wednesday.
Let me know. You know when they’re done or whatever, for example. So you probably have a habitual response to feeling like somebody is wronging you in some way and. There is underneath that, a good reason for that habitual response. And when you can get in touch with what the deeper longing is, you’ll probably find that there’s another way to go about it.
Like there’s another way to secure that, and sometimes it doesn’t even involve the other [00:11:00] person. Sometimes what wants to be seen and felt and acknowledged and heard is like just you to your own gaze. Like you can literally be that for yourself. Like, I fucking see you. I see you, I see you. Like, tell me more.
So I don’t think these concepts are at odds because when you are allowing reality to be what it is, when you’re saying yes to what is, you are not needing. To fix anything about it, you’re not needing to change anything about it. And that doesn’t mean that there isn’t a part of you that is upset, that is frustrated, that feels betrayed, that feels rejected, that feels misunderstood, doesn’t mean that’s not going on like you’re some placid lake of like.
You know, nothing doing in here. It just means that you are going to focus on your actual legit desire and see whether you’re the one who’s supposed to meet that desire for yourself, [00:12:00] or there’s a simple thing that you, and like how to ask for these things, but whether or not there’s something that’s makes sense for you to ask for in this situation.
So you stay with your upset as always, and then you get through that, you get in touch with what it is that you. Actually want, but if there is, um, a credo of the codependent, it is, you know, I know better and I’m going to help you or get you to see what it is that I know, right? And then you’re always taking this bait of imagining that it’s your job.
To organize and fix somebody’s perspective and their experience of reality. Also, that you can just feel safer. So it’s a strategy, right? You give them a few crumbs hoping they’re gonna give you some crumbs back so you don’t starve. Now it’s an old, old [00:13:00] strategy.
